Comments on: Wine: The Firm http://bbrblog.com/2009/02/17/wine-the-firm/ The closest link between the people that make wine and the people that drink it Thu, 02 Sep 2010 20:31:35 +0100 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.2 hourly 1 By: Stapes http://bbrblog.com/2009/02/17/wine-the-firm/comment-page-1/#comment-1963 Stapes Mon, 08 Jun 2009 10:10:16 +0000 http://bbrblog.com/2009/02/17/wine-the-firm/#comment-1963 Thanks a lot Travis. The Fonbel is a cracker! Its one of three wines that CH Ausone makes (The most expensive wine ever released En Primeur is the 2005) The other wine is Moulin St Georges also from St Emilion. The 2004 of this is amazing. Its a tad young but the nose at this time is mind blowing. Thanks a lot Travis. The Fonbel is a cracker! Its one of three wines that CH Ausone makes (The most expensive wine ever released En Primeur is the 2005) The other wine is Moulin St Georges also from St Emilion. The 2004 of this is amazing. Its a tad young but the nose at this time is mind blowing.

]]> By: travis martinson http://bbrblog.com/2009/02/17/wine-the-firm/comment-page-1/#comment-1945 travis martinson Fri, 05 Jun 2009 15:10:33 +0000 http://bbrblog.com/2009/02/17/wine-the-firm/#comment-1945 I've just noticed your response. I've already ordered my first box at bbr.com and went for the mixed quaffable clarets and they are all fantastic. I've enjoyed them all for different reasons. The St Emillion was smooth and some of the others needed longer to breath to mellow the tannins a bit. Fantastic, I will be back. I’ve just noticed your response. I’ve already ordered my first box at bbr.com and went for the mixed quaffable clarets and they are all fantastic. I’ve enjoyed them all for different reasons. The St Emillion was smooth and some of the others needed longer to breath to mellow the tannins a bit. Fantastic, I will be back.

]]> By: Martin Pierce http://bbrblog.com/2009/02/17/wine-the-firm/comment-page-1/#comment-1826 Martin Pierce Sat, 14 Mar 2009 14:19:58 +0000 http://bbrblog.com/2009/02/17/wine-the-firm/#comment-1826 I wasn't going to comment but am just amazed at Greg's. I am not a well-heeled wine buyer but buy a few cases each year from a handful of different merchants. A few comments (1) BBR's website is the best of all of them and is backed up with excellent customer service for all of us, (2) BBR balances sense of history (its own and wine's) with a light touch and good sense of humour, (3) the lighter/more relaxed side came across particularly strongly in the film, so I am amazed Greg ended up feeling the opposite. Have always felt BBR go some way towards 'being human' through blog newsletter etc but the film was great at humanising further - esp. Simon and Jasper. Keep up good work BBR - the world is a better place for your existence. I wasn’t going to comment but am just amazed at Greg’s. I am not a well-heeled wine buyer but buy a few cases each year from a handful of different merchants. A few comments (1) BBR’s website is the best of all of them and is backed up with excellent customer service for all of us, (2) BBR balances sense of history (its own and wine’s) with a light touch and good sense of humour, (3) the lighter/more relaxed side came across particularly strongly in the film, so I am amazed Greg ended up feeling the opposite. Have always felt BBR go some way towards ‘being human’ through blog newsletter etc but the film was great at humanising further – esp. Simon and Jasper. Keep up good work BBR – the world is a better place for your existence.

]]> By: Simon Staples http://bbrblog.com/2009/02/17/wine-the-firm/comment-page-1/#comment-1825 Simon Staples Fri, 06 Mar 2009 09:01:12 +0000 http://bbrblog.com/2009/02/17/wine-the-firm/#comment-1825 @ Daniel My pleasure. But dont get me started on 007 Rhone....What a revelation! Cheers Simon @ Daniel

My pleasure. But dont get me started on 007 Rhone….What a revelation!
Cheers

Simon

]]> By: Daniel http://bbrblog.com/2009/02/17/wine-the-firm/comment-page-1/#comment-1824 Daniel Mon, 02 Mar 2009 22:59:54 +0000 http://bbrblog.com/2009/02/17/wine-the-firm/#comment-1824 Simon - I just thought that someone ought to say a big 'thank you' to you for taking the time to answer all of the many and varied questions raised here in such detail. It really has been very interesting and enjoyable to follow all of these blog comments. Simon – I just thought that someone ought to say a big ‘thank you’ to you for taking the time to answer all of the many and varied questions raised here in such detail. It really has been very interesting and enjoyable to follow all of these blog comments.

]]> By: Simon Staples http://bbrblog.com/2009/02/17/wine-the-firm/comment-page-1/#comment-1823 Simon Staples Fri, 27 Feb 2009 16:38:26 +0000 http://bbrblog.com/2009/02/17/wine-the-firm/#comment-1823 <p>@ Daniel<br /> When we come to buying the majority of our wines we have a slightly lengthy, but I really believe, the most honest way I can think of. For instance, I mention somewhere above, that Max Lalondrelle (Bordeaux Buyer), Mark Ross (Commercial Manager) and I spent a very long and I have to say frustrating week in Bordeaux in September ONLY tasting wines with a cost to us (in Bond) of 2 to about 7.5 euros. A ballpark of 500/600 wines. We individually score all the wines out of 20 and any of those that get a collective mark of 15 or more we look at again together and discuss its merits. We narrowed them down to 10/15 wines which we had samples sent back to the office in "Our Hampshire Cellars" where we and approx. 20 sales people tasted them blind and THEY chose about 6 wines which we bought about 1000/2000 cases of each. These are now in and the sales people start to recommend to their clients. I believe this is a much more democratic and fairer way of buying wine rather than a single buyer who BUYS and tells the sales staff to sell.<br /> We do a similar thing with En Primeur where we go down to Bordeaux over a two week period (approx 20 people) and we choose which wines we think are the best. I think particularly where the tasting is from barrel I prefer having numerous experts opinions rather than diving in on my own and buying 10's of thousands of cases and getting others to sell them. Parker does this all on his own and he obviously has just his palate but he doesn't have to purchase wine. If he did I'd imagine he'd take on a lil'tasting buddy or two. It's also a lot more fun to chat over the wines we might or might not purchase. I hope that shines a little bit of light on our buying.<br /> I'm off to the Rhone for the first time ever this weekend and week ahead to "discover" this great 07 vintage. Very excited indeed. They have to be easier to buy than Bordeaux...it'll be a breeze. I'm sure we shall have a lot to chat about at the tasting next month.</p> @ Daniel
When we come to buying the majority of our wines we have a slightly lengthy, but I really believe, the most honest way I can think of. For instance, I mention somewhere above, that Max Lalondrelle (Bordeaux Buyer), Mark Ross (Commercial Manager) and I spent a very long and I have to say frustrating week in Bordeaux in September ONLY tasting wines with a cost to us (in Bond) of 2 to about 7.5 euros. A ballpark of 500/600 wines. We individually score all the wines out of 20 and any of those that get a collective mark of 15 or more we look at again together and discuss its merits. We narrowed them down to 10/15 wines which we had samples sent back to the office in “Our Hampshire Cellars” where we and approx. 20 sales people tasted them blind and THEY chose about 6 wines which we bought about 1000/2000 cases of each. These are now in and the sales people start to recommend to their clients. I believe this is a much more democratic and fairer way of buying wine rather than a single buyer who BUYS and tells the sales staff to sell.
We do a similar thing with En Primeur where we go down to Bordeaux over a two week period (approx 20 people) and we choose which wines we think are the best. I think particularly where the tasting is from barrel I prefer having numerous experts opinions rather than diving in on my own and buying 10’s of thousands of cases and getting others to sell them. Parker does this all on his own and he obviously has just his palate but he doesn’t have to purchase wine. If he did I’d imagine he’d take on a lil’tasting buddy or two. It’s also a lot more fun to chat over the wines we might or might not purchase. I hope that shines a little bit of light on our buying.
I’m off to the Rhone for the first time ever this weekend and week ahead to “discover” this great 07 vintage. Very excited indeed. They have to be easier to buy than Bordeaux…it’ll be a breeze. I’m sure we shall have a lot to chat about at the tasting next month.

]]> By: Simon Staples http://bbrblog.com/2009/02/17/wine-the-firm/comment-page-1/#comment-1822 Simon Staples Fri, 27 Feb 2009 15:52:27 +0000 http://bbrblog.com/2009/02/17/wine-the-firm/#comment-1822 <p>@Tony<br /> Having just spent the week in Bordeaux tasting a few 2008's but more getting a feel for how it's all going to play out and I have a sneaking suspicion.....and please don't quote me ......The Firsts might well come out first this year and about £1000 a case. Fingers crossed.<br /> As for the 1855 Classification it is bizarre how representative it actually is for the First Growths. They are NOW up to their exalted heights and to taste/drink one is a privilege. There are one or two other Chateaux that merit being there too but it's from them down through the league tables that things get a wee bit more murky. Out of the 14 2nd Growths about half shouldn't be there really in my opinion. We often dabble with the idea of doing a Berrys Classification but as I'd imagine we would never be invited to taste at the downgraded Chateaux ever again!<br /> Now, buying Bordeaux I'm a man who enjoys a bit of tannin but I would never ask for a wine that was "Tannicy!"....Ah well at least the food was good and it wasn't in the Little Chef on the A303!</p> @Tony
Having just spent the week in Bordeaux tasting a few 2008’s but more getting a feel for how it’s all going to play out and I have a sneaking suspicion…..and please don’t quote me ……The Firsts might well come out first this year and about £1000 a case. Fingers crossed.
As for the 1855 Classification it is bizarre how representative it actually is for the First Growths. They are NOW up to their exalted heights and to taste/drink one is a privilege. There are one or two other Chateaux that merit being there too but it’s from them down through the league tables that things get a wee bit more murky. Out of the 14 2nd Growths about half shouldn’t be there really in my opinion. We often dabble with the idea of doing a Berrys Classification but as I’d imagine we would never be invited to taste at the downgraded Chateaux ever again!
Now, buying Bordeaux I’m a man who enjoys a bit of tannin but I would never ask for a wine that was “Tannicy!”….Ah well at least the food was good and it wasn’t in the Little Chef on the A303!

]]> By: Simon Staples http://bbrblog.com/2009/02/17/wine-the-firm/comment-page-1/#comment-1821 Simon Staples Fri, 27 Feb 2009 13:42:14 +0000 http://bbrblog.com/2009/02/17/wine-the-firm/#comment-1821 <p>@ Neal</p> <p>Sorry not to have got back yesterday. The Bordelais weren't playing ball. 2008 is going to be great fun!</p> <p>Tricky issue this one and difficult not to talk in broad generalisations. When I started in this business I thought that Australia, that was just coming on line then in the UK (after we had flirted with Bulgaria and Romania if you recall 20ish years ago) was the Saviour of all things vinous. Wolf Blass and Penfolds wines were a revelation and I told everyone. The fruit was just so sexy that you could not help but love it. Then one day in 1990 when I was working in Harrods Wine department I accidentally (honestly) snapped the neck off a bottle of 1982 Mouton Rothschild. I've got big paws I'm afraid. I called a couple of other team mates round the back and we tried it. It was a total revelation. Within 30 seconds...I got it. Now I know that was a fairly staggering bottle to get ones conversion with but it did start me off in the search of subtlety. Within about 3 months of that day I had drunk 1970 Beaucastel and 1978 La Tache (through the generosity of my customers) and I was totally hooked. But please don't think I'm being elitist about this its just the longer you are into it you end up looking for more and more subtlety which tends to lead to more and more cash. Sadly. As a broad rule of thumb I rarely buy red wine for us at home less than £10.00 a bottle that is French or Italian. (There are one or two exceptions in Bordeaux. Our Extraordinary Claret at £10.50 a bottle by the case, made for us by Lynch Bages is a brilliant bottle for the price and is batting leagues above its price tag. I did buy it for the company so I'm totally biassed. Biassed but proud! And a few from the Languedoc). I can hardly remember buying a bottle of Pinot Noir for less than £20 that was from Burgundy preferring to go to New Zealand or West Coast US every time. Reds from £10-£20 the world really is your oyster as you can get brilliant entry level great Bordeaux (2004 Tourelles de Longueville at £18.75 a bottle is brilliant from BDX) but so to is Waterford Cabernet Sauvignon for £12.75 from South Africa and Pulenta Grand Corte from Argentina at £17.95 is awesome. I really think its over £50 a bottle that Bordeaux falls into the "heritage" category a bit. But there are certain times you have to say that Bordeaux can create ethereal wines that the new World just cant quite match. Earlier this week I retasted at the Ch. Cos Estournel and Palmer 2005 and wine really doesn't get much better than this (I sound like that chap off Masterchef) and at £110 and £200 per bottle are they worth it????..... I really don't know. In times like this they seem expensive and some would say its almost unethical spending that on a bottle of grape juice but what ethereal grape juice. Aston Martin Vanquish or new Fiat 500? Both stylish and sexy. The Aston is 10 x times the price of the fiat. The Palmer 2005 10 x the 2004 Tourelles de Longueville. Sadly being in the wine trade I have Aston taste but Fiat budget (as you saw me in the documentary I'm probably looking for a Citron Berlingo or Transit van!! But you get my point). We have to look for value for our own cellars and everyday quaffing. As for Big Bob......don't get me started! However his scores are only representative of the region AND its vintage that is being reviewed for some totally unfathomable reason. A Cheeky Chilean Cab at £6.95 might get 92 points in a flight of Chilean wines but if you compared it to a 92 point Bordeaux from 2000 at £50 the Bordeaux, in the same flight, the BDX might still get 92 and the Chilean 75 points! Not exactly very helpful. As I say it's also vintage specific so a 2006 Bordeaux such as Cos Estournel has just today been re "pointed" as 94 points and the 2005 at 98 points. The latter I totally agree with and although the 2006 is very good (again tasted this Tuesday by our buying team) in the context of all wines it's not up to that score. So it's totally impossible to compare Parker points when you cross match region or vintage. Sorry a long and rambling answer but I hope that helps. So, in a nutshell, because of duty and Vat it's not really worth buying wine less than £5.00 retail. Stay away from France £5.00 to £10.00 and go crazy all over the world from £10 to £20! If you'd like more specific wines to fit the bill please drop me a line. simon.staples@bbr.com p.s I love Yarra Yerring and have about 10 cases or so in my Cellar Plan.</p> @ Neal

Sorry not to have got back yesterday. The Bordelais weren’t playing ball. 2008 is going to be great fun!

Tricky issue this one and difficult not to talk in broad generalisations. When I started in this business I thought that Australia, that was just coming on line then in the UK (after we had flirted with Bulgaria and Romania if you recall 20ish years ago) was the Saviour of all things vinous. Wolf Blass and Penfolds wines were a revelation and I told everyone. The fruit was just so sexy that you could not help but love it. Then one day in 1990 when I was working in Harrods Wine department I accidentally (honestly) snapped the neck off a bottle of 1982 Mouton Rothschild. I’ve got big paws I’m afraid. I called a couple of other team mates round the back and we tried it. It was a total revelation. Within 30 seconds…I got it. Now I know that was a fairly staggering bottle to get ones conversion with but it did start me off in the search of subtlety. Within about 3 months of that day I had drunk 1970 Beaucastel and 1978 La Tache (through the generosity of my customers) and I was totally hooked. But please don’t think I’m being elitist about this its just the longer you are into it you end up looking for more and more subtlety which tends to lead to more and more cash. Sadly. As a broad rule of thumb I rarely buy red wine for us at home less than £10.00 a bottle that is French or Italian. (There are one or two exceptions in Bordeaux. Our Extraordinary Claret at £10.50 a bottle by the case, made for us by Lynch Bages is a brilliant bottle for the price and is batting leagues above its price tag. I did buy it for the company so I’m totally biassed. Biassed but proud! And a few from the Languedoc). I can hardly remember buying a bottle of Pinot Noir for less than £20 that was from Burgundy preferring to go to New Zealand or West Coast US every time. Reds from £10-£20 the world really is your oyster as you can get brilliant entry level great Bordeaux (2004 Tourelles de Longueville at £18.75 a bottle is brilliant from BDX) but so to is Waterford Cabernet Sauvignon for £12.75 from South Africa and Pulenta Grand Corte from Argentina at £17.95 is awesome. I really think its over £50 a bottle that Bordeaux falls into the “heritage” category a bit. But there are certain times you have to say that Bordeaux can create ethereal wines that the new World just cant quite match. Earlier this week I retasted at the Ch. Cos Estournel and Palmer 2005 and wine really doesn’t get much better than this (I sound like that chap off Masterchef) and at £110 and £200 per bottle are they worth it????….. I really don’t know. In times like this they seem expensive and some would say its almost unethical spending that on a bottle of grape juice but what ethereal grape juice. Aston Martin Vanquish or new Fiat 500? Both stylish and sexy. The Aston is 10 x times the price of the fiat. The Palmer 2005 10 x the 2004 Tourelles de Longueville. Sadly being in the wine trade I have Aston taste but Fiat budget (as you saw me in the documentary I’m probably looking for a Citron Berlingo or Transit van!! But you get my point). We have to look for value for our own cellars and everyday quaffing. As for Big Bob……don’t get me started! However his scores are only representative of the region AND its vintage that is being reviewed for some totally unfathomable reason. A Cheeky Chilean Cab at £6.95 might get 92 points in a flight of Chilean wines but if you compared it to a 92 point Bordeaux from 2000 at £50 the Bordeaux, in the same flight, the BDX might still get 92 and the Chilean 75 points! Not exactly very helpful. As I say it’s also vintage specific so a 2006 Bordeaux such as Cos Estournel has just today been re “pointed” as 94 points and the 2005 at 98 points. The latter I totally agree with and although the 2006 is very good (again tasted this Tuesday by our buying team) in the context of all wines it’s not up to that score. So it’s totally impossible to compare Parker points when you cross match region or vintage. Sorry a long and rambling answer but I hope that helps. So, in a nutshell, because of duty and Vat it’s not really worth buying wine less than £5.00 retail. Stay away from France £5.00 to £10.00 and go crazy all over the world from £10 to £20! If you’d like more specific wines to fit the bill please drop me a line. simon.staples@bbr.com p.s I love Yarra Yerring and have about 10 cases or so in my Cellar Plan.

]]> By: Vino Vangelist http://bbrblog.com/2009/02/17/wine-the-firm/comment-page-1/#comment-1820 Vino Vangelist Fri, 27 Feb 2009 10:38:41 +0000 http://bbrblog.com/2009/02/17/wine-the-firm/#comment-1820 <p>Interesting. The wine show in Burgundy looked like a lot of fun. The gold rush on Burgundy indeed!</p> Interesting. The wine show in Burgundy looked like a lot of fun. The gold rush on Burgundy indeed!

]]> By: Daniel http://bbrblog.com/2009/02/17/wine-the-firm/comment-page-1/#comment-1819 Daniel Fri, 27 Feb 2009 00:15:06 +0000 http://bbrblog.com/2009/02/17/wine-the-firm/#comment-1819 As a recent Cellar Plan member I thoroughly enjoyed seeing 'behind the scenes', and am looking forward even more to your Rhone '07 tasting next month. Simon, reading the comments here about price / new world vs old world etc, compelled me to wonder to what extent you taste 'blind' when selecting wines? As a relative novice I find blind tasting to be a great way to challenge my own preconceptions, to set aside my prejudices about 'brand', price and even region, and to learn about what I actually like as opposed to what I think I like. But is there ever value in an experienced and well trained pallet tasting blind? As a recent Cellar Plan member I thoroughly enjoyed seeing ‘behind the scenes’, and am looking forward even more to your Rhone ‘07 tasting next month.

Simon, reading the comments here about price / new world vs old world etc, compelled me to wonder to what extent you taste ‘blind’ when selecting wines? As a relative novice I find blind tasting to be a great way to challenge my own preconceptions, to set aside my prejudices about ‘brand’, price and even region, and to learn about what I actually like as opposed to what I think I like. But is there ever value in an experienced and well trained pallet tasting blind?

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